Ep 7. What is the school of the future? With Saif Sarwar, Director of Education. Invictus Learning Center
What is the school of the future?
Like the world around us, education is changing.
In this episode I am joined by Saif Sarwar, Director of education at Invictus Learning Center. Saif shares how the education system is changing and how we can use this opportunity to adapt and prepare our children for the future by becoming empathetic, creative and confident individuals.
Season 1 Ep 7
Listen here
0:00:00.240,0:00:04.720
hi mama you’re listening to the mama
podcast it’s sumayya here the co-founder
0:00:04.720,0:00:09.200
of mama ME app
mama me is the first app to exclusively
0:00:09.200,0:00:12.160
connect mothers
across the middle east connect with
0:00:12.160,0:00:15.440
like-minded mamas and create lifelong
friendships
0:00:15.440,0:00:19.439
at mama we are all about connecting
mamas to empower women
0:00:19.439,0:00:22.880
so let’s join together and make this
mission a reality
0:00:22.880,0:00:26.240
today we are talking about education it
has
0:00:26.240,0:00:31.279
all changed and as parents it is so
confusing as to what the best thing to
0:00:31.279,0:00:35.280
do for our children
blended learning is the brand new
0:00:35.280,0:00:38.399
concept
of education and we’ll be talking about
0:00:38.399,0:00:44.079
that in a lot more detail today
i am joined by the incredible save sarwa
0:00:44.079,0:00:47.120
and i’m
so proud to call him my brother-in-law
0:00:47.120,0:00:51.039
he’s making some real changes in the
education sector and i’m so excited to
0:00:51.039,0:00:55.680
bring this conversation to you
welcome save to the mama podcast i’m so
0:00:55.680,0:00:59.199
excited to have you
thanks so much for having me on samaya
0:00:59.199,0:01:03.680
sausage tell me
about invictus um invictus is a
0:01:03.680,0:01:07.600
i think an exciting addition to the
uae’s educational landscape
0:01:07.600,0:01:10.799
and we really do three things first of
which is an online
0:01:10.799,0:01:14.560
education for high school age students
second of all we do
0:01:14.560,0:01:19.280
bespoke tutoring programs and academic
support and extracurricular activities
0:01:19.280,0:01:22.159
that focus on personal and academic
development
0:01:22.159,0:01:25.920
so we’ll get into all of those in more
detail in a second but i just want to
0:01:25.920,0:01:28.799
touch on
your background and i want you to tell
0:01:28.799,0:01:31.280
me and the listeners a bit more about
you
0:01:31.280,0:01:34.720
and what got you to getting involved in
this
0:01:34.720,0:01:38.799
uh as you know samaya i was born in
dubai
0:01:38.799,0:01:43.680
i lived here for 18 years i went to
jabal ali primary school the school on
0:01:43.680,0:01:47.040
the hill
when it was first established and as you
0:01:47.040,0:01:50.960
know my mum was a teacher there
and probably since then i think i’ve
0:01:50.960,0:01:55.600
been interested in education and
in particular the way education is is
0:01:55.600,0:01:59.520
practiced in in the middle east as a
kind of
0:01:59.520,0:02:03.040
third country for for most people who
live there
0:02:03.040,0:02:06.560
and uh yeah all the way through high
school i decided to get involved in
0:02:06.560,0:02:11.680
um in teaching in different forms i was
a guitar teacher when i was about 15 or
0:02:11.680,0:02:16.080
16 and then i got into um football
coaching a few years later
0:02:16.080,0:02:19.840
and then i just carried on the journey
getting involved in classrooms
0:02:19.840,0:02:23.680
in manchester in vietnam and in dubai as
well
0:02:23.680,0:02:28.080
and i think the culmination of that is
is my work with invictus which i think
0:02:28.080,0:02:31.599
ties together a few things that i think
are missing from the uae’s
0:02:31.599,0:02:35.360
educational landscape so over the last
few years you’ve specifically been
0:02:35.360,0:02:39.440
working with
teenagers and young adults and going
0:02:39.440,0:02:45.440
through their a levels or
ib so um
0:02:45.440,0:02:49.120
yeah so i guess you’ve learned a lot
about that kind of age range and what
0:02:49.120,0:02:53.599
they’ve been experiencing
in the dubai high school and before
0:02:53.599,0:02:58.239
obviously lockdown happened um and
since then you’ve still been working you
0:02:58.239,0:03:02.000
ha you did work with them over the
lockdown period as well so i’m sure you
0:03:02.000,0:03:05.840
got a lot of insight into what they were
experiencing from
0:03:05.840,0:03:09.360
a personal perspective not just from an
education perspective
0:03:09.360,0:03:13.599
can you shed a bit more light on to how
your experience was over that time
0:03:13.599,0:03:16.640
absolutely i mean it was a really
challenging time i think for
0:03:16.640,0:03:21.760
for my students um i was a
private tutor um in dubai in that in
0:03:21.760,0:03:26.080
that time period and so
initially it was it was very up in the
0:03:26.080,0:03:29.840
air as to whether there was going to be
exams and so all of our preparation
0:03:29.840,0:03:34.959
in the lead-up to exams was
really quite challenging and i saw the
0:03:34.959,0:03:38.080
psychological pressures on on our young
people which was
0:03:38.080,0:03:42.480
um yeah a challenge to see and that was
one thing that really stuck with me and
0:03:42.480,0:03:47.599
i thought there wasn’t
adequate assistance really from from
0:03:47.599,0:03:51.760
the schools it’s not really a criticism
i just think it was something
0:03:51.760,0:03:56.080
um unprecedented as we’ve heard a
million times over the last few months
0:03:56.080,0:04:03.680
um but i think it was really the role of
um tutors and external educators to
0:04:03.680,0:04:10.640
to put the minds of our young people
at ease once it was announced that there
0:04:10.640,0:04:14.799
would be no
summer exams it was really a sort of
0:04:14.799,0:04:20.320
damp squid in a way um because
students had been revising for two years
0:04:20.320,0:04:24.400
for these exams and
they weren’t able to do them so that was
0:04:24.400,0:04:28.000
the
most important thing was to manage their
0:04:28.000,0:04:31.759
expectations and
and manage their psychological states
0:04:31.759,0:04:35.600
really and keep them active
academically knowing that they wouldn’t
0:04:35.600,0:04:40.800
have to sit in the exams
and the anxiety they must have felt with
0:04:40.800,0:04:44.880
that as well because
change is something that most humans
0:04:44.880,0:04:48.560
struggle with
um funnily enough i was talking about
0:04:48.560,0:04:52.880
expectations with
a friend of mine earlier today and it’s
0:04:52.880,0:04:55.120
really interesting that they’re having
to deal with
0:04:55.120,0:04:59.600
this of reassessing their expectations
at such a young age because i think
0:04:59.600,0:05:02.240
going forward it will probably prepare
them
0:05:02.240,0:05:07.199
for um much bigger changes in that
that’s coming in their life
0:05:07.199,0:05:11.520
i think sometimes you think that the
world is so challenging at the age of 18
0:05:11.520,0:05:14.720
or 16 and then
you learn as an adult that you know it
0:05:14.720,0:05:17.440
was just such a small part of what life
is
0:05:17.440,0:05:21.199
absolutely and i think it’s it’s
difficult to get perspective when you’re
0:05:21.199,0:05:25.600
17 or 18 and so
this is really the gap that i’ve noticed
0:05:25.600,0:05:28.800
in in general in education that there
isn’t this kind of
0:05:28.800,0:05:33.120
there isn’t much significance placed on
enhancing the perspective of our young
0:05:33.120,0:05:35.440
people
they’re caught up with their personal
0:05:35.440,0:05:38.639
relationships with their
worries about where they’re going to
0:05:38.639,0:05:42.320
university and
all of that seems so monumental at the
0:05:42.320,0:05:49.199
time and while it is important obviously
i think there is a need to
0:05:49.199,0:05:53.440
provide students with the i with with
the knowledge that everything will
0:05:53.440,0:05:57.840
probably be okay really going to be
interesting to see what happens over the
0:05:57.840,0:06:00.720
next year
or two especially since coming out of
0:06:00.720,0:06:04.000
lockdown i think a lot of these
institutions will reassess
0:06:04.000,0:06:07.520
how they do things and how they prepare
the children
0:06:07.520,0:06:11.600
and young adults for the future and i
think this has been discussed for so
0:06:11.600,0:06:13.840
long now
it’s something that comes up over and
0:06:13.840,0:06:19.840
over again about how we’re preparing
our future generation for the future
0:06:19.840,0:06:23.600
i mean this is where invictus comes in
because this is sort of an online
0:06:23.600,0:06:26.400
platform so i think it’ll be great to
talk about whether you think
0:06:26.400,0:06:30.639
homeschooling is the way forward
and what your opinion and how invictus
0:06:30.639,0:06:33.440
sees that going forward
this has been something i’ve been
0:06:33.440,0:06:37.919
thinking about for for quite some time
i mean and it’s been more emphasized in
0:06:37.919,0:06:41.120
this
situation that we don’t really know what
0:06:41.120,0:06:45.360
the future is going to be like
this has taught us this and let alone
0:06:45.360,0:06:48.560
what’s
what the next 5 ten or fifty years are
0:06:48.560,0:06:52.560
going to be like i mean leia
um is going to be retiring in about 50
0:06:52.560,0:06:56.800
years
uh hopefully and we have absolutely no
0:06:56.800,0:06:58.960
clue
what the world is going to be like and
0:06:58.960,0:07:01.599
yet we’re meant to be educating our
children
0:07:01.599,0:07:06.720
with that 50-year timeline in mind so it
all seems a little bit strange to me
0:07:06.720,0:07:10.880
that we’re
locked into these very
0:07:10.880,0:07:16.400
conservative and unchanging models of
education and i think online education
0:07:16.400,0:07:20.639
is is
at least a step in the direction of
0:07:20.639,0:07:23.360
change and i think that change is
necessary there is
0:07:23.360,0:07:27.199
fundamental change needed to our
education system and so
0:07:27.199,0:07:31.360
one of our key services if you like is
this online education which is
0:07:31.360,0:07:36.000
supplemented by what we call a blended
approach where we have in-person
0:07:36.000,0:07:41.759
activities
that support a kind of fully online high
0:07:41.759,0:07:45.840
school education so what that means
is that student attends the lesson
0:07:45.840,0:07:49.599
online and they have a
teacher that they can that facilitates
0:07:49.599,0:07:54.000
that lesson who’s on video
what they can do or the blended aspect
0:07:54.000,0:07:56.879
of it is
after class they might consult their
0:07:56.879,0:08:01.280
personal tutor who
has a very personalized development plan
0:08:01.280,0:08:06.160
about their strengths their weaknesses
and this is meant to help their overall
0:08:06.160,0:08:09.440
development it’s not meant to
0:08:09.599,0:08:15.680
criticize them for not doing things
correctly it’s not meant to
0:08:15.680,0:08:20.560
stifle their creativity it’s
it’s a very very personal and
0:08:20.560,0:08:26.000
individualized approach which i think
can only really be captured through this
0:08:26.000,0:08:29.840
blended
model and in addition to that
0:08:29.840,0:08:33.039
out what we do outside the classroom is
also essential
0:08:33.039,0:08:36.320
and that’s why we’ve come up with these
what i think are quite unique
0:08:36.320,0:08:40.000
co-curricular activities add more
strings to the bow of our young
0:08:40.000,0:08:44.000
people i think that’s really what’s
missing as well if i’m a student here
0:08:44.000,0:08:47.600
how personalized would my experience be
and how would you personalize that
0:08:47.600,0:08:50.320
experience
you know when we come into our
0:08:50.320,0:08:53.839
professional lives
we’re acutely aware that our personal
0:08:53.839,0:08:58.000
development is something that we should
be aware of and something we need to
0:08:58.000,0:09:01.920
work on perpetually
this string of self-development podcasts
0:09:01.920,0:09:06.000
that we see
are evidence of that and yet at school
0:09:06.000,0:09:10.800
it’s rare we hear this word
um and possibly that has to do with the
0:09:10.800,0:09:14.320
fact that we have
1 to 20 ratios in the classroom and it’s
0:09:14.320,0:09:19.360
very difficult to give children
a personalized
0:09:20.839,0:09:25.519
education the fact remains though that
education isn’t one size fits all and so
0:09:25.519,0:09:30.240
it really just makes sense to have a
a personal plan for each child and so if
0:09:30.240,0:09:32.880
a child were to
enroll at invictus learning center for
0:09:32.880,0:09:37.760
their online education
they first of all go through a process
0:09:37.760,0:09:42.240
whereby we do
diagnostic tests we have long-form
0:09:42.240,0:09:44.880
interviews we listen to uh to our
children
0:09:44.880,0:09:47.839
what they want to do what they feel
they’re good at what they feel they’re
0:09:47.839,0:09:52.640
terrible at
where they want to be and so on
0:09:52.640,0:09:55.760
along with other personality tests and
the like
0:09:55.760,0:09:59.120
and based on that we build a very
personalized plan
0:09:59.120,0:10:02.839
and with this plan it’s not just for
show it
0:10:02.839,0:10:07.440
informs every decision and every part of
their education so
0:10:07.440,0:10:14.399
let’s say for example um somebody has
a learning difficulty or they are a
0:10:14.399,0:10:18.000
kinesthetic learner and they like to
touch and feel things and move
0:10:18.000,0:10:21.200
around while they’re learning well then
we’ll integrate that into their learning
0:10:21.200,0:10:27.040
there’s no point um having somebody who
can’t learn a certain way and trying to
0:10:27.040,0:10:30.079
ram that way of learning down their
throat i’m sure we’ve all been there
0:10:30.079,0:10:32.000
when we’re trying to revise something
and it’s just
0:10:32.000,0:10:38.240
not working for us so we really try to
personalize education based on the
0:10:38.240,0:10:40.320
individual which seems to make sense to
me
0:10:40.320,0:10:45.920
i mean absolutely i think just in my
close circle of friends at school we all
0:10:45.920,0:10:48.640
learn
in such a different way yet we all went
0:10:48.640,0:10:52.959
to the same
classes taught by the same teacher and
0:10:52.959,0:10:56.000
it was such a blanket approach to
teaching
0:10:56.000,0:11:00.480
which was i’ll stand at the front and
teach you and talk to you and talk at
0:11:00.480,0:11:03.120
you
um i actually had a very different
0:11:03.120,0:11:05.839
experience going through university
because
0:11:05.839,0:11:09.279
university exposed me to a slightly
different form of learning
0:11:09.279,0:11:12.880
which is where i came into sort of
learning that there’s different methods
0:11:12.880,0:11:15.360
of learning and different methods of
teaching
0:11:15.360,0:11:19.440
and it’s really interesting that you
integrate this into someone’s learning
0:11:19.440,0:11:22.800
do how do you test that this is one
beneficial for them
0:11:22.800,0:11:28.720
and actually is it working and
do you then say a month later realize
0:11:28.720,0:11:32.000
that maybe this isn’t the right method
of teaching for this child and does that
0:11:32.000,0:11:34.079
change
i think our learning styles change over
0:11:34.079,0:11:38.959
time that’s for sure
but since we’re each very different
0:11:38.959,0:11:45.519
we do have certain inflections
that don’t change and so we’ll continue
0:11:45.519,0:11:49.440
to do sort of
monthly or termly learning style tests
0:11:49.440,0:11:52.639
to
identify these nuances so yeah we’ll
0:11:52.639,0:11:56.160
keep
a very close watch in our students and
0:11:56.160,0:12:00.079
monitor the way that they learn and as
well as monitor their results
0:12:00.079,0:12:04.160
that’s kind of where we are different to
everybody else
0:12:04.160,0:12:07.680
i think corvid has taught us that an
online
0:12:07.680,0:12:11.360
curriculum is something that can be
easily implemented
0:12:11.360,0:12:15.600
of course there’s the element of having
someone watching over your child if
0:12:15.600,0:12:18.320
they’re at home
all the time and parents have to work or
0:12:18.320,0:12:24.000
go to an office
with that being said how do you feel i
0:12:24.000,0:12:26.639
mean
there must be a downside to children
0:12:26.639,0:12:29.680
being homeschooled
in terms of they’re not in a school
0:12:29.680,0:12:32.320
setting they’re not seeing other
children
0:12:32.320,0:12:35.279
the thing that i’ve seen over the last
couple of weeks is parents are really
0:12:35.279,0:12:38.240
and children are really excited about
going back to school because they’re
0:12:38.240,0:12:43.440
going to see their friends
from from the research is that our
0:12:43.440,0:12:47.360
social and cognitive development can be
impacted by disassociation or
0:12:47.360,0:12:51.360
disconnection with other children so
we’ve had a long think about this and
0:12:51.360,0:12:55.839
i think the best way around this or the
best way to
0:12:55.839,0:13:01.839
deal with this issue is to have online
home school in a collective setting so
0:13:01.839,0:13:04.639
we
the learning centre have an open plan
0:13:04.639,0:13:09.120
space where children can come
in and do their home school from our
0:13:09.120,0:13:12.560
center so they’re not they don’t
necessarily have to be at home um and
0:13:12.560,0:13:16.160
this tackles this feeling of perhaps
alienation that children might feel if
0:13:16.160,0:13:18.079
they’re just sitting in their laptop at
home
0:13:18.079,0:13:21.120
um and then second of all we we have
this
0:13:21.120,0:13:24.880
focus on after-school co-curricular
activities and that’s really where we
0:13:24.880,0:13:28.959
address this
this problem of socialization and social
0:13:28.959,0:13:32.880
development which i think is essential
um even in this world where everything’s
0:13:32.880,0:13:37.120
on zoom anyway this is really um
at the heart of of our educational
0:13:37.120,0:13:41.360
philosophy this idea that we need to
prepare our children for their futures
0:13:41.360,0:13:45.760
with soft skills it’s a really it’s a
big shame that they’re even called soft
0:13:45.760,0:13:48.720
skills because as you know these are the
skills that are critical
0:13:48.720,0:13:54.320
they are the skills that make people um
pursue their dreams and invent things
0:13:54.320,0:13:57.199
and be innovative and unlock their kind
of
0:13:57.199,0:14:01.199
their human potential so we’ll get into
those those activities because i’m
0:14:01.199,0:14:05.199
really really excited
about them um but that’s how we address
0:14:05.199,0:14:09.760
that problem if you like of
social disconnection so i guess it’s a
0:14:09.760,0:14:13.519
bit like a cool
working space but for students that’s a
0:14:13.519,0:14:15.360
really good point actually yeah it is
like
0:14:15.360,0:14:19.920
we work yeah but for students i mean if
i was a 15 year old that would be a
0:14:19.920,0:14:23.279
pretty exciting place to go to for sure
absolutely i remember when i first got
0:14:23.279,0:14:27.120
to university it was
quite exhilarating that you could go to
0:14:27.120,0:14:30.320
a kind of
class or a seminar and then everybody’s
0:14:30.320,0:14:33.920
still talking about it
afterwards you know the conversation
0:14:33.920,0:14:38.000
spills out of the lecture hall
into the cafe everyone continues
0:14:38.000,0:14:41.600
discussing the topic and
from my perspective that’s where a lot
0:14:41.600,0:14:44.560
of the learning takes place through
dialogue and discourse
0:14:44.560,0:14:48.320
whereas in the classroom well maybe this
is just for me but i was told to
0:14:48.320,0:14:51.839
zip it and conversations were meant to
be kept to a minimum
0:14:51.839,0:14:55.600
whereas we want to encourage that kind
of group dialogue
0:14:55.600,0:14:58.560
and discourse because i think that’s
really where all the fun and all the
0:14:58.560,0:15:01.440
learning takes place
0:15:02.000,0:15:05.839
yeah and that’s where we sort of
developed those soft skills which you
0:15:05.839,0:15:09.360
mentioned
so i think as a parent it is really
0:15:09.360,0:15:12.639
important for me
to raise my daughter having these soft
0:15:12.639,0:15:16.480
skills i would like her
to be empathetic to understand her
0:15:16.480,0:15:19.839
emotions to
be able to co-create with other people
0:15:19.839,0:15:23.680
and you know
be able to work in a team and not just
0:15:23.680,0:15:26.160
focus on
the academics and i know this isn’t the
0:15:26.160,0:15:28.959
case for all parents and i appreciate
that
0:15:28.959,0:15:33.199
parents come from a different
perspective um but let’s say that is
0:15:33.199,0:15:37.519
a priority for a parent and that’s what
they want their child to learn
0:15:37.519,0:15:41.360
this is the thing that really sort of
sets invictus apart from
0:15:41.360,0:15:45.839
a traditional schooling system so i’d
love for you to sort of
0:15:45.839,0:15:49.920
tell me about this more in detail and
actually tell me what the advantages
0:15:49.920,0:15:54.000
of um all these core curriculums love to
a lot of it is really based
0:15:54.000,0:15:57.440
off one of my heroes and he was one of
my mom’s heroes as well
0:15:57.440,0:16:02.560
um sir ken robinson who recently
unfortunately passed but he was a
0:16:02.560,0:16:06.560
fascinating educator who had he really
took the world by storm with his ted
0:16:06.560,0:16:11.120
talk i’m sure you’ve seen and lots of
lots of others have enjoyed um and he
0:16:11.120,0:16:13.680
really says that creativity is as
important
0:16:13.680,0:16:16.800
as literacy that might seem quite
controversial
0:16:16.800,0:16:20.240
but what he means is that our kids have
this tremendous talent and we sort of
0:16:20.240,0:16:25.680
squander them
by boxing them into academic
0:16:25.680,0:16:29.360
subjects and academic disciplines i’m
not knocking academia i’ve
0:16:29.360,0:16:33.440
just received my master’s diploma in the
post
0:16:33.440,0:16:37.600
and i intend to carry on my education
too but what what he means by this and
0:16:37.600,0:16:41.920
what we mean
by these co-curricular activities which
0:16:41.920,0:16:46.320
are based on this principle
is that the lengths and the the depths
0:16:46.320,0:16:50.320
of human potential are not quite
captured by what is in books
0:16:50.320,0:16:54.800
and uh innovation and creativity has to
flow
0:16:54.800,0:16:57.839
from other sources and it has to has to
be
0:16:57.839,0:17:01.759
stimuli for children to express
themselves creatively
0:17:01.759,0:17:05.839
so that’s all great theoretically but
what do we actually do
0:17:05.839,0:17:08.880
to to ignite and spark those eureka
moments
0:17:08.880,0:17:12.240
well first things first we do we have
this
0:17:12.240,0:17:15.760
fantastic organization that we’re trying
to build
0:17:15.760,0:17:19.600
called dubai debate society we go into
schools and
0:17:19.600,0:17:24.079
train children in the basics of
communication and debating
0:17:24.079,0:17:28.240
this is really based on the idea that we
need to be able to express
0:17:28.240,0:17:31.360
ourselves and we need to be able to
communicate as
0:17:31.360,0:17:35.200
we’re doing right now and it’s extremely
difficult to master that
0:17:35.200,0:17:40.799
art and most adults you talk to have
issues with communication that’s partly
0:17:40.799,0:17:44.640
because
there isn’t a lesson about communication
0:17:44.640,0:17:47.360
in school
we might have presentations i remember
0:17:47.360,0:17:50.160
trying to
get out of them or used to stuff my
0:17:50.160,0:17:52.400
hands in my pockets and kind of mumble
something
0:17:52.400,0:17:56.400
but we want to have a fresh approach to
all of this and
0:17:56.400,0:18:00.240
teach our children the fundamentals of
communication
0:18:00.240,0:18:05.200
and listening active listening
and that’s where empathy comes from and
0:18:05.200,0:18:09.600
that’s where great ideas as part of a
group comes from
0:18:09.600,0:18:13.440
as well as that we have a innovators
challenge
0:18:13.440,0:18:17.039
where we’re trying to unlock innovation
in our young people
0:18:17.039,0:18:21.360
we often speak about the um the
difficulties of starting businesses
0:18:21.360,0:18:24.720
and exciting new businesses in the
market but
0:18:24.720,0:18:28.160
that’s something that comes very very
late to people these great ideas
0:18:28.160,0:18:32.880
and we think that
children should be given the opportunity
0:18:32.880,0:18:37.600
to develop a startup or to take a
product to market
0:18:37.600,0:18:41.679
i think children are extremely creative
and
0:18:41.679,0:18:45.760
that’s why i mentioned ken robinson he
says that schools kill our creativity
0:18:45.760,0:18:52.240
and so if we allow them the platform to
go on canva and design a marketing
0:18:52.240,0:18:55.520
leaflet for this
fantastic sustainable project product
0:18:55.520,0:18:59.039
that they designed
why not put it on etsy or why not put it
0:18:59.039,0:19:03.760
on a website where they can sell it
that’s what that co-curricular activity
0:19:03.760,0:19:08.480
is about
and then of course we have a what we
0:19:08.480,0:19:11.200
like to call
our inspiration evenings where we try to
0:19:11.200,0:19:14.720
get a kind of diversity of professionals
to talk
0:19:14.720,0:19:18.400
um to young people about what they do so
we might have you come in
0:19:18.400,0:19:22.240
talk about your transition from
dentistry to entrepreneurship
0:19:22.240,0:19:27.520
we might have um my brother and your
husband sal come in to talk about his
0:19:27.520,0:19:33.679
um transition from his working
transition from one sector to another
0:19:33.679,0:19:37.440
and so on
what this tries to address is the
0:19:37.440,0:19:41.200
problem
of young people not knowing what jobs
0:19:41.200,0:19:47.919
are out there and what they can do
and our seminars and workshops on these
0:19:47.919,0:19:55.440
careers evenings should help children
yeah i mean that’s a really interesting
0:19:55.440,0:19:59.520
point because
i decided on my career at the age of 18
0:19:59.520,0:20:01.679
world champ the world changed a lot
through
0:20:01.679,0:20:06.400
our sort of growth and our upbringing
and i don’t feel
0:20:06.400,0:20:10.640
school really prepared you for what was
going to change and how it was going to
0:20:10.640,0:20:13.360
change and what kind of skills you
actually had
0:20:13.360,0:20:16.720
and i think that’s really important to
address
0:20:16.720,0:20:20.159
now going forward because if we could
bring those mentors
0:20:20.159,0:20:24.559
into these children’s lives at an
earlier age then maybe we could
0:20:24.559,0:20:28.400
access those the potential a much
younger age and i think that’s something
0:20:28.400,0:20:32.799
that you do as well with mentorship
and it’s really interesting to hear you
0:20:32.799,0:20:36.159
absolutely and this is
strangely i’ve found something that
0:20:36.159,0:20:40.640
doesn’t feature again in our
general education system when you go
0:20:40.640,0:20:46.480
into professional
life having a mentor is normal
0:20:46.480,0:20:51.120
whereas at school you seldom meet
somebody from outside the schooling
0:20:51.120,0:20:54.640
system who
unlocks something within you that’s
0:20:54.640,0:20:59.039
really what i
define a mentor as someone who can see
0:20:59.039,0:21:02.559
something in you that you might not know
about yet
0:21:02.559,0:21:05.919
and that’s i think such an incredibly
powerful thing especially as a young
0:21:05.919,0:21:10.480
person to be told
that you’re fantastic at
0:21:10.480,0:21:13.840
dreaming these big ideas and you could
actually design something that’s going
0:21:13.840,0:21:16.720
to change the world one day
you know can you if you can imagine
0:21:16.720,0:21:23.120
being told that as a 17 18 year old
um well you might have egomania
0:21:23.120,0:21:29.440
egomania after that but what it will
generally do is unlock something in you
0:21:29.440,0:21:33.120
and
motivate and inspire you to be the best
0:21:33.120,0:21:38.480
person you can be and that’s what i see
as a mentor and it just seems
0:21:38.480,0:21:44.679
like such a such an obvious thing to
partner children or young people up with
0:21:44.679,0:21:49.039
non-teachers
non-educators and open their eyes to
0:21:49.039,0:21:56.880
a diversity of careers or diversity of
fields that they possibly are unaware of
0:21:56.880,0:22:00.080
you know you become an adult you get
into this corporate environment and you
0:22:00.080,0:22:03.039
look for a mentor and you find a mentor
to help support you
0:22:03.039,0:22:06.240
and i guess if you’ve been exposed to
that from such a young age then it’s
0:22:06.240,0:22:09.120
something that you will
work towards very quickly and you’ll
0:22:09.120,0:22:12.000
know the potential that that can give
you from a very very
0:22:12.000,0:22:16.320
young age without you know having to
learn that in your mid-20s or your 30s
0:22:16.320,0:22:18.640
which is
generally what seems to be happening
0:22:18.640,0:22:21.760
absolutely and i know i referred to
these like self-development podcasts
0:22:21.760,0:22:25.919
before
that gets awakened in us in the
0:22:25.919,0:22:32.000
millennial generation in our twenties
if we have a generation of
0:22:32.000,0:22:35.760
self-reflective
self-developmental young people can you
0:22:35.760,0:22:38.000
imagine
where they’re going to be when they’re
0:22:38.000,0:22:44.240
25 to 30 and
i think what we have now is a remarkable
0:22:44.240,0:22:49.200
opportunity
in light of our own journeys as
0:22:49.200,0:22:54.080
development
as self-developing individuals to pass
0:22:54.080,0:22:57.440
the baton on to our younger generation
and allow them
0:22:57.440,0:23:00.480
the opportunity to think about what
they’re good at
0:23:00.480,0:23:04.799
what they want to do and give them a
path to get there
0:23:04.799,0:23:09.679
that’s just seems really really
important i think
0:23:09.679,0:23:12.799
yeah i mean i i definitely agree with
that and
0:23:12.799,0:23:17.200
i think if we could bring that
generation into that sort of wider
0:23:17.200,0:23:19.600
thinking
i’m sure as the generation if if they
0:23:19.600,0:23:22.640
are sort of growing to think outside of
the box and they are learning that these
0:23:22.640,0:23:25.520
other skills
university and time will change as well
0:23:25.520,0:23:29.840
and obviously it’s
a bit of a knock-on effect um
0:23:29.840,0:23:33.120
one thing that did come up as you were
talking then was
0:23:33.120,0:23:37.600
the fact of impostor syndrome now i know
this is a really
0:23:37.600,0:23:41.039
you probably don’t have the answer to
this but i’m really interested to hear
0:23:41.039,0:23:44.400
what your thoughts are on imposter
syndrome because
0:23:44.400,0:23:48.000
it’s such a big thing that we all deal
with
0:23:48.000,0:23:53.120
this sort of self-criticism and like not
believing or thinking that we
0:23:53.120,0:23:56.720
can do it or we have the skill set to do
it and i feel that
0:23:56.720,0:23:59.760
just that thing that you mentioned about
if you had a mentor that told you you
0:23:59.760,0:24:04.320
had those skills
from the age of 14 15 then i’m sure
0:24:04.320,0:24:07.520
imposter syndrome will be something of
the past i certainly hope so this is
0:24:07.520,0:24:11.279
something i have thought about and
you do hear a lot about it on these
0:24:11.279,0:24:14.960
podcasts about
entrepreneurs and startups and things
0:24:14.960,0:24:19.279
like that and i think you’re right it is
it emerges from a kind of self-doubt
0:24:19.279,0:24:24.799
that we you know we all have
but you’re right we can put that
0:24:24.799,0:24:27.760
self-doubt into perspective if we have
the right tools
0:24:27.760,0:24:31.120
and often we don’t have those tools
because nobody’s told us
0:24:31.120,0:24:35.039
by the way everybody feels like a bit of
an imposter at some stage
0:24:35.039,0:24:42.400
but you’ve got this and strangely
it is this giant phenomenon
0:24:42.400,0:24:46.159
particularly in people who are
successful and that makes you
0:24:46.159,0:24:49.760
wonder if there’s a systemic problem
with
0:24:49.760,0:24:57.120
individual self-worth and
self-reflection so i think if we
0:24:57.120,0:25:01.440
have a kind of mentorship program where
children have to reflect on their
0:25:01.440,0:25:06.720
strengths and weaknesses
perpetually then anytime you have that
0:25:06.720,0:25:10.159
little flicker of doubt about
whether you’re whether you’re an
0:25:10.159,0:25:14.720
imposter you can refer back
to your uh your notes really and your
0:25:14.720,0:25:19.039
mental
history of um that’s going to emphasize
0:25:19.039,0:25:22.240
to you that actually
you’re not an imposter and you’ve got
0:25:22.240,0:25:26.400
this
you’ve got the ability to to succeed
0:25:26.400,0:25:28.960
you’ve got the ability to excel but i’m
interested
0:25:28.960,0:25:33.360
if you’ve ever felt impossible imposter
syndrome because you seem so confident
0:25:33.360,0:25:36.480
you seem so competent
and obviously in your career as a
0:25:36.480,0:25:39.840
dentist you’ve got a
certification on the wall that says you
0:25:39.840,0:25:44.640
can do the job do you ever go in there
and feel like an impostor
0:25:44.720,0:25:49.840
um interestingly i think i think yeah i
think everyone to a degree does
0:25:49.840,0:25:55.840
um imposter syndrome definitely in the
early years of being a dentist for sure
0:25:55.840,0:26:00.320
um but i don’t know if that’s because
of you’re still building confidence i’m
0:26:00.320,0:26:04.400
not quite sure
but as building a business and becoming
0:26:04.400,0:26:06.799
an entrepreneur for sure you feel a lot
of
0:26:06.799,0:26:10.720
imposter syndrome and i think that’s why
i’m more aware of it now as well because
0:26:10.720,0:26:12.960
i’ve done
some research and it’s apparently very
0:26:12.960,0:26:16.480
common in women too
um i think you touched on something
0:26:16.480,0:26:18.320
really important there where you said
that
0:26:18.320,0:26:21.520
you know it’s about knowing your
strengths and weaknesses and i think
0:26:21.520,0:26:25.039
sometimes
especially in the education system
0:26:25.039,0:26:28.320
traditional education system and the
education system we went through it’s
0:26:28.320,0:26:31.279
very much focusing on
what you do well but less about what
0:26:31.279,0:26:35.039
your weaknesses are
and so now building a business it’s
0:26:35.039,0:26:38.640
really important to actually know and
acknowledge that look i’m not so good at
0:26:38.640,0:26:41.520
this but there is somebody else that’s
way better at
0:26:41.520,0:26:45.919
that than me and that’s the person that
needs to be exactly exactly
0:26:45.919,0:26:49.440
you you really hit an important point
there samaya where you say that the
0:26:49.440,0:26:54.240
education system
chastises us or demonizes failure
0:26:54.240,0:26:59.279
when all you hear when you go into
business or into work is how
0:26:59.279,0:27:03.360
failure is the launch pad for success
you need to fail
0:27:03.360,0:27:06.799
every day and be aware of what you fail
at so that you can do better do
0:27:06.799,0:27:10.799
something quite serious about this
um this problem of self-confidence
0:27:10.799,0:27:13.039
that’s one of our three c’s actually if
i
0:27:13.039,0:27:16.159
can shoehorn that in um they are
communication
0:27:16.159,0:27:22.000
creativity and confidence and
this problem of confidence i think
0:27:22.000,0:27:26.399
emerges when we categorize
what people can do based on their gender
0:27:26.399,0:27:30.320
or where they’re from
or what their families do i studied
0:27:30.320,0:27:34.080
philosophy as well as economics at
university and i saw this split
0:27:34.080,0:27:40.399
where in economics lectures you could
barely see a woman whereas in
0:27:40.399,0:27:44.960
a philosophy lecture was entirely made
up of women
0:27:44.960,0:27:47.520
and i found the same thing when i was
doing my a-levels in my literature
0:27:47.520,0:27:51.120
classes
it was dominated by women in my
0:27:51.120,0:27:55.600
economics classes
it was dominated by men so is this
0:27:55.600,0:27:58.320
because
women aren’t very good at economics well
0:27:58.320,0:28:01.520
absolutely not
is it that men are terrible at
0:28:01.520,0:28:07.679
expressing their literary
um ideas no so there’s a problem here
0:28:07.679,0:28:13.200
and i think confidence is
certainly uh one of the reasons why this
0:28:13.200,0:28:16.960
problem emerges
so what do we do to address this is that
0:28:16.960,0:28:21.200
we
don’t encourage children to internalize
0:28:21.200,0:28:26.080
that then they can’t do something
and we see this from such a young age
0:28:26.080,0:28:31.039
like i was recently shopping for
some toys to bring back to bring over
0:28:31.039,0:28:35.840
here to for leia
um and there was a kind of girls section
0:28:35.840,0:28:40.960
in early learning center
which had all this sort of barbie
0:28:40.960,0:28:45.279
pink stuff and then the boys section was
building and architecture and
0:28:45.279,0:28:48.399
engineering toys and so when you look at
the research
0:28:48.399,0:28:54.559
what this leads to is a domination
in the engineering and the stem subjects
0:28:54.559,0:28:58.480
by
boys and the social sciences and
0:28:58.480,0:29:02.960
humanities
mainly made up of that’s really quite
0:29:02.960,0:29:07.200
interesting i do
now see those safe that um parents and
0:29:07.200,0:29:10.320
way
are a lot more aware of this and
0:29:10.320,0:29:14.159
therefore are introducing or
you know there there are talks and
0:29:14.159,0:29:18.799
conversations about
less gender biased toys and you know
0:29:18.799,0:29:22.960
activities that aren’t gender bias
to bring it back again to ken robinson
0:29:22.960,0:29:27.360
one of the main
points he makes on this subject is that
0:29:27.360,0:29:31.279
for in order for children to find their
elements as he calls it they need to try
0:29:31.279,0:29:34.799
things
they need to be given the opportunity to
0:29:34.799,0:29:40.399
try their hand at different things and
allow them to fail so if you do have
0:29:40.399,0:29:45.440
a younger person just put them in
different types of activities and that’s
0:29:45.440,0:29:50.880
kind of why we have this
range of activities um at invictus is
0:29:50.880,0:29:56.559
not for 16 year olds who have
their mindset on becoming a lawyer to
0:29:56.559,0:30:01.360
only do debating
to hone their craft while that is
0:30:01.360,0:30:06.080
advised we’d like a 16 year old who
isn’t very confident and who
0:30:06.080,0:30:09.840
tries to hide in classroom discussions
to do debating
0:30:09.840,0:30:13.279
and this is i think where you have real
development
0:30:13.279,0:30:19.840
and by trying new things out and by
as you mentioned earlier thinking
0:30:19.840,0:30:24.399
outside the box through
doing outside the box we
0:30:24.399,0:30:28.480
tend to box our children in in from a
very very young age you know you
0:30:28.480,0:30:32.720
mentioned how you
study dentistry at university but
0:30:32.720,0:30:36.000
you were on a pretty clear path to that
point by choosing
0:30:36.000,0:30:40.159
your triple science gcse and by
specializing in science when you’re at a
0:30:40.159,0:30:43.919
level
now you were 15 when you chose your
0:30:43.919,0:30:47.279
gcses
and that affected the entire trajectory
0:30:47.279,0:30:51.760
of your life
so that seems like a thing of the past i
0:30:51.760,0:30:54.399
feel
and the way we kind of combat this i
0:30:54.399,0:30:58.640
think is by just
giving students the opportunity to try
0:30:58.640,0:31:03.039
their hand at multiple
multiple skills hence what we want to do
0:31:03.039,0:31:06.960
is expand
their potential and open their eyes to
0:31:06.960,0:31:11.120
different things that they could do and
whatever it is they would like to do if
0:31:11.120,0:31:17.200
they’d love to study
economics and they’d love to become or
0:31:17.200,0:31:20.480
aspire to become an accountant you can
still
0:31:20.480,0:31:24.159
improve your life as an accountant
through
0:31:24.159,0:31:27.440
gaining soft skills and gaining
technical
0:31:27.440,0:31:31.279
competencies in areas such as
communication and
0:31:31.279,0:31:34.559
you’ve got to be creative with numbers
too so
0:31:34.559,0:31:38.240
these types of skills that we’re trying
to engender in our children
0:31:38.240,0:31:42.559
don’t um guide them towards certain
careers they don’t certainly don’t
0:31:42.559,0:31:45.760
confine them
to entrepreneurship or or create the
0:31:45.760,0:31:50.240
creative arts what they do is
add more strengths to their bow so
0:31:50.240,0:31:54.000
whatever it is they choose to do
we’re giving them the confidence to do
0:31:54.000,0:31:57.360
that we’re making them better
communicators and we’re making them more
0:31:57.360,0:32:00.159
creative
in their personal and their professional
0:32:00.159,0:32:05.279
lives which
as a parent i’m sure you recognize that
0:32:05.279,0:32:08.240
all those three things are pretty
applicable to even
0:32:08.240,0:32:11.600
having a successful or effective
household
0:32:11.600,0:32:14.480
having experienced what i’ve experienced
through my life i know that this is
0:32:14.480,0:32:17.679
something
that i would love for leia to sort of um
0:32:17.679,0:32:21.919
enroll into
and have and be exposed to um the one
0:32:21.919,0:32:25.679
thing that we do know is
change is a constant and i think we
0:32:25.679,0:32:31.360
really need to accept that as humans and
sort of teach our children that too
0:32:31.360,0:32:36.159
anything 2020 has taught us
is that change is inevitable and that we
0:32:36.159,0:32:39.840
have to sort of take exactly and that’s
really the role if we
0:32:39.840,0:32:44.960
go back to what education is really for
it is meant to prepare us for this
0:32:44.960,0:32:51.039
future that we can’t quite grasp as
ken robinson says again and that
0:32:51.039,0:32:56.000
there is this kind of feeling within
education
0:32:56.000,0:33:00.000
that if we keep doing the same thing as
we’ve done before
0:33:00.000,0:33:04.159
everything will be okay to the needs of
our children and we should
0:33:04.159,0:33:09.440
be flexible to the way the world is now
rather than stuck in the past and so
0:33:09.440,0:33:14.320
if we can endow our children with these
skills early on
0:33:14.320,0:33:17.760
they can pick them up keep them with
them if they want to start off
0:33:17.760,0:33:23.919
as a engineer and go into consulting and
try their hand at being a performer in
0:33:23.919,0:33:28.000
the theater
that’s okay but they’re going to need a
0:33:28.000,0:33:34.559
foundation of skills and i think
we’ve come upon an idea that’s going to
0:33:34.559,0:33:39.440
allow them to do that
a lot of parents have opted to
0:33:39.440,0:33:42.960
homeschool their children alongside
their traditional schooling like
0:33:42.960,0:33:46.080
with their traditional schools so if
they were enrolled into a school
0:33:46.080,0:33:50.240
they’ve chosen to to homeschool using
that school’s method
0:33:50.240,0:33:54.640
how is invictus different i mean you’ve
already told us about the core
0:33:54.640,0:33:57.440
curricular activities and i’m assuming
if they switch and do
0:33:57.440,0:34:01.440
invictus they would be automatically
enrolled into these core curricular
0:34:01.440,0:34:04.240
activities we had a really
great discussion about the fact that
0:34:04.240,0:34:07.279
you’re going to expose them to a
recording studio
0:34:07.279,0:34:10.800
and like access to recording equipment
so they can
0:34:10.800,0:34:13.520
create a youtube channel if that’s
something they’re interested in or
0:34:13.520,0:34:17.040
record a podcast and put that out and
learn about podcasting
0:34:17.040,0:34:20.480
which i think is really exciting because
these skills are definitely
0:34:20.480,0:34:23.599
even if they don’t do anything with them
as an adult maybe they don’t become
0:34:23.599,0:34:27.599
the next joe rogan but at least it will
be something that will
0:34:27.599,0:34:31.520
help them um in the future we’re a giant
umbrella semi
0:34:31.520,0:34:35.040
and there’s this there’s something for
everybody whether you’re in traditional
0:34:35.040,0:34:37.919
school
let’s say you are you can come down to
0:34:37.919,0:34:42.000
the center at the mac hills
community center and get involved in an
0:34:42.000,0:34:46.240
after school activity
if you’d like to have something very
0:34:46.240,0:34:49.599
specific to your to your taste
or to your interest and we can
0:34:49.599,0:34:54.480
personally design a
co-curricular activity around that um i
0:34:54.480,0:34:57.280
often see
students scrambling around around the
0:34:57.280,0:34:59.599
time they’ve got to write their personal
statements
0:34:59.599,0:35:02.880
not knowing what to put on it a lot of
them end up just writing
0:35:02.880,0:35:07.760
as i’m sure you did duke of edinburgh
which is extremely limited in what it
0:35:07.760,0:35:12.960
teaches you
um and so what we’re trying to do is
0:35:12.960,0:35:19.760
provide um some
core skills and core competencies to our
0:35:19.760,0:35:22.480
young people so even if you are a
traditional school you can
0:35:22.480,0:35:27.119
come down and um and have something that
you can take away with you and use
0:35:27.119,0:35:30.720
practically for the rest of your life
alternatively if you are
0:35:30.720,0:35:35.440
at invictus online education you’re as
you say automatically enrolled in these
0:35:35.440,0:35:43.119
activities and that will be your social
aspect to your ad to your education and
0:35:43.119,0:35:46.720
uh you mentioned
the the homeschooling option for schools
0:35:46.720,0:35:49.280
in dubai
0:35:49.440,0:35:53.599
i think that’s that’s an important idea
obviously online education is locked
0:35:53.599,0:35:58.480
down proof and virus proof in a way
because nothing’s really going to impact
0:35:58.480,0:36:01.200
your insecure
don’t think the virus is going to impact
0:36:01.200,0:36:04.160
our internet connections just yet
although that
0:36:04.160,0:36:11.280
that doesn’t sound too far off
that you really you can you can shape
0:36:11.280,0:36:16.560
your education
um around you when does the
0:36:16.560,0:36:20.079
curriculum start and when does school
start for invictus because i know the
0:36:20.079,0:36:22.400
schools are going back in a couple of
days
0:36:22.400,0:36:28.720
and we’re recording this on the 27th
so um when do you guys stop by we start
0:36:28.720,0:36:33.040
on the 15th
of september 2020 and um
0:36:33.040,0:36:36.320
that is our provisional start date
however
0:36:36.320,0:36:40.640
you’re free to start online education at
any point in the year
0:36:40.640,0:36:44.480
so it gives you that extra flexibility
if you’re undecided at the moment about
0:36:44.480,0:36:51.680
where to send your child to school
we can enroll students up till
0:36:51.680,0:36:55.280
january so there’s no need to worry
about that come down
0:36:55.280,0:37:01.119
to the mac hills community center we do
a free consultation and chat with parent
0:37:01.119,0:37:05.760
and child
and wear an open book ask us anything we
0:37:05.760,0:37:09.760
realize that this is a new take on
education and there are going to be lots
0:37:09.760,0:37:13.200
of questions but we welcome that we want
there to be questions and we want
0:37:13.200,0:37:16.480
students to get the most out of their
education so
0:37:16.480,0:37:20.640
come down ask away and we really look
forward to
0:37:20.640,0:37:24.640
to starting the school year i’m
exceptionally excited about it
0:37:24.640,0:37:28.560
and even if you are enrolled at
traditional school
0:37:28.560,0:37:31.760
um come down and and we’ll have taster
sessions we’ll have
0:37:31.760,0:37:36.480
personal statement writing workshops
coming up and um
0:37:36.480,0:37:39.680
hopefully we’re going to have you down
somewhere to talk to our young people
0:37:39.680,0:37:43.760
about your journey
um and any parents listening to this get
0:37:43.760,0:37:47.040
in touch
um on our twitter or instagram and if
0:37:47.040,0:37:50.400
you’d like to come talk to
some young people about the interesting
0:37:50.400,0:37:54.000
jobs or lives that you have we’d love
for you to come down and
0:37:54.000,0:37:57.520
really look forward to it i’m sure the
children that are
0:37:57.520,0:38:01.280
already enrolled are really sort of
looking forward to getting stuck back
0:38:01.280,0:38:05.760
into
some form of schooling um i will put all
0:38:05.760,0:38:09.359
your details in the show notes so
um if listeners want to find you they
0:38:09.359,0:38:12.480
can just pop the
pop to the show notes um and the links
0:38:12.480,0:38:16.400
will all be there so they can
um find you on the social media pages
0:38:16.400,0:38:19.599
i’ll put your website in there as well
so they’ve got a contact for you thanks
0:38:19.599,0:38:33.839
so much for having me on tomorrow
thank you it’s a lovely day as always
0:38:43.839,0:38:45.920
you
Invictus learning website, contact: info@invictuslearningcenter.com. @invictuslearningdxb
Find more blog posts here